Changes 12/15/08

[Admin Acacia]

Some changes were made to fix up a couple of things and to add an item or two as craftables in game.

* [point command removed. This was pretty much a worthless command and did cause some problems with crashes.

* Tweaks made to the [grab command so that it will only loot corpses.

* Tweaks with the [sort and [dump commands

* Changes with the apple bobbing basket.

* Addition of all items needed to craft snowmen

If you notice any problems with these changes, please report them.

[Cpt_Starfox]

Thanks!  we're now all pointless!   
Ok... as cheesy a joke as that was... please don't kill me... although I probly deserve a good pie to the face for that one....

Ok, now... one small little bugger with the grab thing....
Please, for the sake of and to prevent shard lag, to promote shard cleanliness, help keep the remains of my sanity, to solve world hunger, to bring about world peace, to give free ice cream too all.... ok that was a little over the top... you can leave off the ice cream part... sry    Ok, please make the [grab work for arrows... those arrows are most annoying in so many ways... 1. they drive me nuts... 2. we atone to help keep from there being so many things that have to time out via decay and thus lag the shard and arrows come by the bucket load and can sit there a long time, 3. they are most annoying around boats.... and 4. they drive me nuts... 5. they crowd up and look messy.... 6. they drive me nuts... wait I think I said that... anyway... just a small thing I hope, but please help my sanity... or what's left of it... hehe 

[Serenity]

Link,

  Do you ever do back and read your post and think WOW how many people can I confuse in one day ?


Seren.

[Aesa]

We took away that part of the command on purpose Link.  It's quite frustrating to run an event where players have to find items on the ground and they don't even look, they just run around and hit their [grab macro every half second.  Takes away the purpose of the event and makes players actually have to work for their prize   You'll have to pick up the arrows manually, or just let them be.  They will decay soon enough and I'm sure they don't cause THAT much lag, if any at all.  I've never ran thru Destard where an archer has been and left all their unused arrows and thought "OMG! The lag is horrible because of these arrows" Lol   The command will work as intended.  Sorry Link.

[Christina]

i am sure there will be some frustration with the changes but i am sure once everyone gets use to it, I am sure everyone will be happy. I am excited to see the new craftables. I want  to say thank u Staff for all your hard work. And all ur great ideas that have been put in play the last few months.

[Cpt_Starfox]

I didn't mean undo it completely... I know it was done that way on purpose (except maybe not thinking of arrows), I agree with the reason for changing the grab... but I mean just make it to wear it can work for arrows without making it as general as it was before... and I'm pretty certain that can be done.... being the type of hunter I am... I like to leave a clean hunted area... no arrows and not many if any bodies or other things.... it just drives me crazy to leave em... but I don't wanna pick up a trillion arrows... but leaving em is like littering or something to me.... ack!

-edit-
What I am suggesting would work something like this:

Keep the fixed code (looting only from corpses) - it is good to have grab fixed 

Add an area grab effect to the same command that works like it did before except ONLY for arrows.

And that is it.

[Crimson]

The only event I see that benefits the [grab command mostly is a champ spawn, well the end of a champ spawn to be more specific. Using the [grab command to clean up all those piles of gold at the end I'm sure is quite helpful. Other than that I am glad that I won't accidentally be picking up any invisible items anymore. There has been on more than one occasion that staff has peeked in my pack and asked me why I have a spawner or something unusual that I shouldn't have in my pack. I'd simply have to tell them I had no clue it was there since to me its invisible and I didn't know it was there. Oh and speaking of invisible loot, I have a pack sitting on the steps of one of my homes that is full of invisibles (I believe they were from Fel) that I just haven't gotten around to paging about for a long time now.

I'm looking forward to the rest of the changes as well as the [grab command change. I know I've been guilty of using the [grab command in the past in the same fashion Aesa explained, it was a quick easy way to pick stuff up without actually looking for an item. The way it is now will make the hunt for items a little more of a challenge, and I have nothing against a challenge.

[Admin Acacia]

I know it is really hard to deal with some changes we make here, and believe me, none of them are made to punish players.   The thing is, the [grab command was intended to be just a corps loot command... working on your kills.   That being said, we just made some adjustments so that this command would work how it was intended to work.     I know it will make a bit more work for us all to have to pick stuff up off the ground, but what's a few more seconds.

[Quezecoatl]

I know sometimes id use the grab command to grab a deco item i dropped and it went behind stuff and got lost and ctr shift only brought me all the stuff around it X) also for champ spawn gold at end and dark sider gold, just some useful times when grab was area and picked off ground X).

[Cpt_Starfox]

Yeah what Que said.... and what Crimson said... especially what Que said... those decor items are SUCH a pain to find at times lol (I have soooo been there and done that lol)

There's gotta be an easy way to do this... and still get the best out of those events like Aesa said... there's gotta be a way to have our cake and eat it too lol 

Maybe making the grabable items list dynamically changeable by staff... or be able to turn it off in an area where there is an event kinda like turning off spells in an area.... I would imagine though, that there isn't a "grabable items list" but there could likely more easily be a "non-grabable items list" that could be dynamically changeable by staff... Yes, I think that sounds much easier to script.

[Skynar]

1. I agree with the arrows thing being an archer

2.   it really is kinda funny that the staff is concerned about the Yoinking during events. When i have specifically asked there be no yoinking and was told that that staff member didnt care  about it  Then in next event yelled at for it. then in next event complained about it and told  didnt care.


I dont get it. its seems like the things that people DO want in mass.. you dont want to implement because of a FEW against.   Then something that most DONT want in mass.. you go ahead and implement because a few are for it.

frustrating to say the least. not to mention the multiple times everyone says we dont have a scripter and how many times I have offered to help and been ignored.

Maybe im ranting and maybe im pointing out things that the staff should think about and question if it is affecting the level of players on this shard.  I mean honestly  This IS one of the most friendly and unique shards i have found... But the amount of frustration is causes sometimes outweighs the pros.


Let the bashing on me begin. But  it  really is  frustrating to me and i do not get it at all.

Roy

[Caelan]

Here's a little suggestion, before I kill you.

There is an option on razor:

Agents-Scavenger-Add Target-(Gold/arrows)-Set Hot Bag-(Your Loot Bag)-Push to Enable

Enabling that one feature will allow you to pick up any gold and/or arrows nearby.

Now, before I kill you, let me make a little point here. Changes that are made on the shard are done for the benefit of the shard, not just one or two players. The original post for this topic ended by saying "If you notice any problems with these changes, please report them." That means that your constructive comments count. It may be possible to alter the command as a result of player input. I personally see no need for it to be altered myself, but then I use razor and know that I can easily use the scavenger agent to get items.

As for events that staff may have yoinking issues with, there are several. Not all staff are bothered by it, but some get very ticked off by it. Why? Because when you spend a lot of time setting something up only to have a player run around hitting the grab command to get items it seems kind of unfair to other players not doing it. Not because they cannot do it, but because they choose to actually look for the items. By the way, I am one staffer that gets very ticked off by the yoinking at special events. Champ spawns are different, there is tons of gold after the champ is killed that needs to be picked up. However, if I spend hours making special items, I'm not going to be happy with yoinkers taking everything when I run an event.

The Invisible Maze is a great example of this. Staff make special items for people to get. Maybe 10 players show up for the event, staff places 10 items, out of the ten players, 3 get all of the items. Not because they got close enough to all of the items to pick them up, but because they got close enough to use the grab command to get them. This makes the players actually going to the item to get it not want to do the event.

So here's what happens:
The event turn out gets low because only certain players get special items. Staff gets frustrated offering events no one wants to do because only certain players get the special items. Staff try to figure out ways to rectify the situation. Changes are discussed and made. Players complain, giving the changes little or no chance, because they don't want to adapt to anything being done differently, despite the fact that it may be better for everyone playing. Rinse and repeat.

So, it's not just frustrating for players, but also for staff. It's like any efforts that are made to make the shard more enjoyable or to help it run smoother are pointless to some players.

As for the scripting, we have someone in the wings working on stuff, so your offer was not ignored. I personally added you to the naughty list for scripting, I just didn't tell you! There are TONS of things with scripting that need to be done. It's overwhelming. I, and I am only speaking for myself and not other staff, would rather keep a players offer for scripting on the back burner for a while then have them stressed out over scripting issues that leave them little or no time to play the game.

We have also been dealing with other things that have made it higher on the priority list. While scripting is certainly important, there are other things we are working on that require more attention at the moment. So, if, after I kill you a few hundred times, I suddenly begin discussing scripting with you, don't act surprised, your day IS coming!

Now, in conclusion to my long winded rant, the point of it all is please try to give things a chance before you start running around like Chicken Little yelling "The sky is falling! The sky is falling!" Nothing is set in stone, changes are not made lightly, and we do listen to constructive remarks and try to find ways to fix what isn't working right.

Thank you all for your input!

[Skynar]

"As for events that staff may have yoinking issues with, there are several. Not all staff are bothered by it, but some get very ticked off by it. "


This is my point exactly  Half say yes  half say no.. One person will one staff wont.   So now you have to wait for a certain staff to get a certain thing done because  a. the other staff doesnt know they can or B. doesnt want to or c. doesnt agree etc etc etc.

as far as playing on the shard... boring to me right now.. why you think i completely nuked my plots and started from scratch ...  I dont have a strong enough character to battle the big mobs and looting chests or killing orcs all day is old.  I think half the events are not "fair to everyone" and ive stated why and been told tough Caca  over it. and yet i continue to offer help and come here.   So either im stupid,  a glutten for punishment, or underneath all the frustration is something worth it. But again i say Its  becoming outweighed by the frustration.


Oh and for the record.. im the guy whos already set up a shard on my own machine to figure out your scripting issues, Has Gm'd on one of the first ever private UO shards, and has offered repeatedly to do scripting/webscripting or whatever the hell else it is ya need to make it succesful here. 

So Go kill someone else

Roy

[Caelan]

Nope, I will be killing you!

You're not getting off that easy!

As far as half and half on which staff will or won't permit yoinking, my suggestion would be to ask the staff doing the event. Staff have a right to do events in their own way in order for it run smoothly for them. If you don't agree with the way one runs an event, don't participate when they run it.

No one said the events were "fair for everyone". Most events are geared for specific player types and there is a big variety. Many are rarely done because of the lack of participation from players. If there is something specific you want, geared for your type of player, talk to me in the game about it and we can work something out. I've done it before, so no problems with trying it again. There are several events that I personally hate doing so something different might be a nice change for all, if you are willing to talk it over with me.

If you are bored playing on the shard then I'm not sure what to tell you. We have a shard council that players can go to and make suggestions to as well as staff. I bug you enough in the game for you to know that I am willing to listen to your concerns (and toss pies at you) and I've not heard you tell me anything about this until now. Also, you're a deco addict that is never satisfied with your plots! ADMIT IT! That's why you nuked ya plots and started over from scratch! Apparently I'm a stupid glutten for punishment too, because I jump on your pages to see what you're gonna do next. Or, maybe it's your cologne, not sure...(I swear he smells like cookies!)

As for the scripting stuff, again, we have someone working on scripting issues and they were doing that when you made your many offers. As I stated before, that is not a top priority at the moment and will be addressed when it is necessary and feasible.

Next time I see you in game, have a paper and pen handy because I will be bugging you yet again and you might want to take notes!

[Mina]

  LOL,  Skynar has is own shard coz he likes doing deco all day..*giggles*  and not all of us use razor...some (me) dont use anything but standard uo. 
  Thirdly...now i know why gold don't get yoinked when darksider drops it..lol

   Changes happen...get on with it everyone  *smiles*