Where Do We Go From Here?

[Kalif]

I have kinda stayed away from this post, because it saddens me to see sylvan at such a low point. But to see so many responses from people weather they be good or bad brightens it all because it shows people still care and still have interest in our good ol home know as Sylvan. So here goes my 2 cents which is pretty much just repeating things you have already heard but is my opinion all the same.....

Switching to a better running program would give sylvan more options, sure, but would take away everything that makes sylvan unique.
The low sever player count could be comeing from numerous things these days and times, it could be holidays, midterms and school (which i know are kicking my butt) or it could be the harsh economy. Sylvan has so much to do on it and to offer, that i personally doubt its the server itself that is lacking. While we all agree there are things that could be done to improve the old sylvan (yes there is a long list i am sure) "most" are simple fixes. And whats to say even when we do the new program switch over it will all be fixed or better? sometimes newer isn't better. I have been on sylvan almost 2 years now, and have never been one for collecting shinies (except for pets now adays "pets his babies") but people who have collected them for the years sylvan has ran i am sure will miss them if they have to start over. Either way i am completely positive the great  players of this great shard will support the decisions of the bunny goddess and the great staff who help make this shard what it is, just figured i would toss my 2 cents out there.


Oh one more thing... I saw a thing about "over powerd money makers and over powerd players"...I admit Kalif's  and Aadors boxers even has sockets in em, but sockets, nor power or money is hard to come by...you have to put the time and effort into it. And not only fighters make money. i have a miner who can make money as quick as my fighters. It just all takes time and effort. And as far as monster/player power balance, i believe cpt_starfox said it earlier, there is a creature for almost every skill level there is. Wheather it be in fel or tokuno or trammel. You just have to find it. And i personally will tell ya there are tons of things out there that can't be soloed by one person (and yes i am one who tries to solo everything and alot lately i pay the price (insurance price that is) so please don't let that be a issue.

[Skynar]

"there is a creature for almost every skill level there is. Wheather it be in fel or tokuno or trammel. You just have to find it."


Actually I think what was said is the lower skill monsters loot is blah. and I know it was set that way. so i think that is really in invalid argument unless you want to kill 200 little mobs to match the one big mobs which also keep in mind the little mobs dont give the good loot or shineys that the big mobs do that the power players sell to other powerplayers because they have the gold to afford it.
its a vicious circle  LOL.   but oh well, I still have the coolest house  <sticks out tounge> lol

Its a wash and irrelevant but I did want to point out that  it really isnt a good point.

Either way ill stick around.   Acacia if you want help coding. I can give it a shot . I dont prefer C sharp but all i need is a few examples of what you have going on  and I can run with it and prob either finish your current stuff or help with change to 2.0 shard.  I have offered multi times.

[Quezecoatl]

Thing is higher level mobs may drop better things but that makes people want to get stronger to get those better things becoming stronger involves playing more until eventually you can take on the bigger mobs even then you still improve on the little things sometimes people bunker down at a certain mob level and then ask why they cant take on the bigger things like other people those are the people who just need a nudge, and the thing is ive gotten mythic augs from a v.bunny so possibilities are always out ther for money jumps to help your goals, some of the simplist creatures to kill drop some of the most wanted valuables people are trying to buy.
But this is not the topic for this debate.

[Stroem Safai]

I couldent help but notice i just went to xtreme 100 and voted and i clicked on details and there is no shard information, a lil story on the lands perhaps, and no pictures! I think pictures should deffinatly be there i feal that when someone looks at the pictures it kind of tells you what the lands are like and gives you a small feal for the game, ahh well just something i noticed

[Queen Karina]

I am in support on what ever Acacia decides , I have alot of shinies  some  are one of a kinds , and i have sockets in all of my characters and some of the rarest of tameables  and i am willing to give all of that up if it helps make the shard better  , if we do switch to 2.0  cant we  make new custom art ?  well what ever  is decided i will always stick with sylvan  even though i am not on as often as i would like , 

[Iggy]

I know noone has seen myself or jasmineleigh on as of recently...here is why

I have recently reenlisted back into the Army and I will be stationed at Fort Bragg, North Carolina. We have been packing the house up as much as we can with Jas being pregnant and having 2 lil boys around...Its not that we gave up on playing the shard its that we have been extremely busy with getting things done here in real life before we start divulging back into game life =)

Now my 2 cents pretty much is repeated off of everyone and I am very pleased to see that everyone has has put in their comments.

Going to runUO 2.0 will be a good thing and a bad thing...good thing being that their is a lot of new content that can be put into the server and I mean A LOT!!!...now the bad thing of course being all the time and effort people put into getting everything they own...myself all i really care about for my characters is my pets that I have gained on the shard...Sure I would greatly miss em a whole bunch, but if in the end to make the shard better would be to redo it and change to 2.0 I will be all for it...

Just my 2 cents ...I found em layin on the floor so I thought I would spend em on here =)

Jasmineleigh and I love u all and we will be back in the near future once we get settled in down in North Carolina...We miss you all...God Speed!

[Erif]

Whatever direction this goes, I will support Acacia, and Sylvan as much as I can.

[Couron]

About the complexity of connecting to Sylvan hearts Shard:

It is not complex, but there are various "old" data that leads to wrong results, I am currently surfing around and seeking correct way of connection. I`we found already that using 9th anniversary UO client seems like a bad idea (Seems like 9th anniversary Client isnt the cause of problems), judging by forum posts ( Used this FTP link ftp://largedownloads.ea.com/pub/uo/setup-1.46.0.3.exe that I found through http://www.sylvandreams.co.uk/content/view/44/15/ from there I got 9th anniversary client Age of Shadows). Now I`m Downloading UOML_setup as I am typing this. I will post results of what i`we done if I succeed.

Usually new users disappear just becouse there are no instructions how-to...with big red letters on main page of forum 
Need to find a stable setup that works for everyone, and put it out with red letters;...easy to say though   

EDIT: As i`we said before, connection is not complex, but the data is scattered all over the forum, after a few hours of data compilation, I think I managed to connect, UOgateway detects my client and everything seems to work.
I made a compiled thread of everything i had done, in this thread http://www.sylvandreams.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=4224.0

[joshua]

I am not an active player on SH but I have been lurking around the forum all the time. I have also run my shard before, not so successful as SH, but get some share of making technical decisions behind the curtain. So please take whatever is useful out of my opinion and disgard the rest:

I am someone who believes in "informed decision". I read everybody's reply, and in my opinion, an informed decision means a few things:
1. What is the real cause of the low activity? Is it a dip of play time, or a dip of interest? How about a poll like this:
A. I have very little time play games these days, but if I do, I spent considerable amount of it on SH.
B. I do have enough time play games these days, but I only spent a small portion on SH.
In my opinion, change the gameplay would be the solution for case B, but for A, the margin is small.
2. Going from RunUO 1.0 to 2.0, what are the possible promised game enhancements and features? Is it possible to come up with a list of potential features that people feel good to add to the shard, that can only be done in 2.0 but not 1.0 (or at least takes much more effort for 1.0 than 2.0)? For some, it may not be clear what RunUO 2.0 really brings. To trade a blob of rosy mist for something people have invested months on, I can tell why some players do not like the idea. Instead, if people understand clearly what RunUO 2.0 brings, it would make much easier and solid judgement.
3. Somewhat similar to my point #2: Nobody likes drastic change or starting anew. If a platform switch is decided because of pro overweight con, is it possible to run a test 2.0 shard at the same time as the 1.0 production shard? When a player sees for him/herself what it would be like to play on the promised better platform, it makes much easier and sound decision. And in case majority does not like the change, the shard can still stay with the 1.0 shard.
4. A question not so urgent but important anyway, if a platform switch or major gameplay change is the way to go, what would players be able to keep, or not keep? Technically, I think it might be impossible to keep the whole world save when going from 1.0 to 2.0, but is completely possible to do some kind of partial transfer like skills/stats, player's liquid asset (gold). Though game balance wise, the perspective might be completely different what to keep and what not to.
5. A specific example of my point #4, taking away sockets, is that because of balance issue, or platform switch? If there is going to be a platform switch, will the socket system be introduced back again if it is technically possible, or not at all because it is believed it is bad for game balance?

Just share my 2 cents and I am willing to offer a hand if scripting wise there is such need. SH is a great shard in so many aspects and I truely respect, even though occasionally I don't fully agree with certain features for pure game balance consideration. I truely wish the best for SH.

Rocko

[Aesa]

I`we found already that using 9th anniversary UO client seems like a bad idea,

I use 9th anniversary edition w/ no problems.  I have installed it on 3 computers that have all been on Sylvan and one computer a second time because of reformatting.  I've never had a problem getting connected to Sylvan.

[Admin Acacia]

I am just getting back to semi-normal after being away for Thanksgiving holiday.   Rocko, I liked your post.  A lot of good things to think about there.  I plan on getting a post together and will include some response to some things Rocko had to say as well as other players, trying to answer some questions in steps toward making a final decision.

If we switch to RunUO 2, it will be a TON of work to get things situated and get players moved over.  It won't be a small task, and... it is NOT going to guarantee that we'll have 100 players in game.

[Cpt_Starfox]

"1. What is the real cause of the low activity? Is it a dip of play time, or a dip of interest?"
Good question... I think that is what most everyone has already been answering in so many words in this topic... but it might be a good question to ask directly too...
As far as a poll though... well, I don't trust em. It's hard to get truly accurate information from a survey/poll. You can get all kinds of information, but whether or not is it an accurate picture of how things are is another story.

For example, take this simple obvious question:
"Do you think changing to RunUo 2 would be a good thing?"
My answer would obviously be "no," but other people might say "yes." Some of the "yes" might be those who are fine either way but are are willing to change even if not strongly wanting to change... basically they'll flow either way and so answer "yes"... still some of the same people might also answer "no." It's not as clean cut and dry as one might think... there are so many factors that are hard to take into acount in a poll or survey.

or for example the two question you suggested...
I fall on both at times... sometimes I'm busy with another game trying to acomplish something that is driving me crazy in it... so I take a slight break from SH... but other times I'm not here as much due to just being very busy... and other times I'm here hours and hours. Reguardless, I generallly try to log in at least once a day even if only to say "hi"    But... what I'm saying is... my answer to such questions would vary greatly depending on the time asked.

I honestly don't think our admins and gms would be careless in making any survey if they decided to use one, but I just don't trust surveys... they're not as easy and accurate as people like to think.

I like Acacia's idea so far, which has been to put up this post (and sounds like another to come) and put out ideas and get people's views and opinions. I believe you can get much more acurate information when you let people say all of how they feel and not limit them to certain responses to limited questions in a poll or survey.  It seems Sylvan has generally done things this way (using "view gathering post"), and while I might not have always fully agreed with the out come... I think it is a good method of finding out how people really feel - thanks Acacia 

"For some, it may not be clear what RunUO 2.0 really brings. To trade a blob of rosy mist for something people have invested months on, I can tell why some players do not like the idea."
Well, first... I'd like to change "months" to "years" to include everything that we have done and those who have gone before us have done... all the special items that show events of the past... the monuments built to honor or remember legendary members of the past... (The momument in Mag, the Vu Castle, Rithick's house, other momuments, and near countless books). Anyway... also... I get kinda a general idea of what it has... part of it being additions to the house builder tool... and while these may look neat, we already have some of them added as sought after craftables I think... and the other stuff isn't really that uber. And, despite any amount of new stuff... I'm standing firm (as I think I've already made pretty clear heh) that I care not to lose the history or balance of our shard in any way. Still, a list of "runuo2 only" things might be a neat idea... even if we never change over, we can look at what it has and see what we can do in version 1 that might be somewhat equivient to version 2.

"is it possible to run a test 2.0 shard at the same time as the 1.0 production shard?"
This sounds ok, but I'd hate to split our userbase... if we're already low on users and low on staff... it'd be like spreading us kinda thin... both players and staff alike. Like if there are already complaints about not enough staff log in time (which there should not be... but sadly there seems to be - grr) then that would likely only make it worse I'd think. And, about seeing low numbers... if the players are split... that's gonna make already low numbers look lower - at least for one version or the other if not for both.

"A question not so urgent but important anyway, if a platform switch or major gameplay change is the way to go, what would players be able to keep, or not keep?"
I could hardly care less about keeping my 120 skill levels and 150 stat levels.. or even waht little gold I have... or even my Vs collection... What I care about is keeping the current, wonderful balance and preserving our rich, hard worked for, amazing history. Which again, let me restate (because I like saying it and because I like bragging on Sylvan hehe) We proably have more history and personality shown in just one single house than other shards do in their entire worlds and even more than WoW probly does in all it's "uber" graphics system. The history a lot of games have is probably written by the programmers and designers as an overall game story and then played out by the players...every player coming to the the same end or set of endings... it means little past it's completion and offers limited replay value.  Our history is diverse and creative being created, written, lived, even recorded, and I hope also treasured by the players and staff together. It is amazing what we have here in balance and in history.

"A specific example of my point #4, taking away sockets, is that because of balance issue, or platform switch? If there is going to be a platform switch, will the socket system be introduced back again if it is technically possible, or not at all because it is believed it is bad for game balance?"
Good question... but even if sockets are kept, we might maintain most of our current balance but likely still lose most of our recorded history... which is a terribly depressing thought to me.

I also greatly love Sylvan - it is indeed a wonderful shard in more ways than I probly even acknowledge. Even though I do not always agree with what happens, on major issues that I may strongly disagree with, I still generally try to find a middle ground I can stand in and a compromise I can offer... I havn't found it on this issue yet, but we'll see. I love Sylvan, and it would depress me to see it change too extremely.

[Skynar]

"the monuments built to honor or remember legendary members of the past... (The momument in Mag, the Vu Castle, Rithick's house, other momuments, and near countless books)."

Easily recreated on another version.

I just want to reiterate  Its not the Material but the People who make the History...

Acacia I am glad to help anyway I can with your scripting issues. Just let me know if you need or want it.

[Cpt_Starfox]

"Easily recreated on another version."
Perhaps *some* of it can be remade... but easily?  I highly doubt it would be too easy... It took a while just to remake one place that was damaged... I'd hate to think how long it would take to replace so much more... if anyone even bothered to try. I dunno about anyone else... but I'd hate to try spending my time trying to replace what I can't replace and trying to rebuild and recreate things that should have never been destroyed.

"I just want to reiterate  Its not the Material but the People who make the History..."
Ok, I'll reiterate too 
People live the history - the "artifacts" show and record it and retell it long after the people have gone. There is a lot to be remembered on this shard... and I don't remember it all, and I doubt you or pretty much anyone else does either. Thankfully, at the moment, we have various material things to help us remember what we might forget    *shrugs* Maybe everyone but me has a perfect memory and goes around passing on by mouth, all of everything that has happened on Sylvan, but I doubt it   

[Skynar]

you win.. it will all be terrible and we should stick with what is not working.