I believe there is a lot of panic going on with the proposed NPC Vendor changes. This is something that has been discussed, and was brought to us by players, it isn't just something Staff pulled out of our hats. There have been previous posts concerning this upcoming (no, it isn't active yet) changes. Here is one of them: http://www.sylvandreams.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=3961.0
This is being planned to add to our role play environment, to give crafters more of a role, and the chance for more player interaction. We have a great group of players, and I'm rather annoyed at the comments I've been hearing how these players will now gouge gold on basic items. Do you honestly think you will pay 2000 gold for a bolt of cloth to make bandies when anyone can easily make it? What this means is, players will need to take just a bit more time to make or find something. It doesn't mean you'll go broke buying apples.
There are some basic items that are being left on all NPC vendors who would normally sell them, regs, empty bottles, books, water, tinker tools. NPC smithies will sell basic katana, kryss and buckler to help the new player. There is no need to panic that you'll be standing in game in only your skivies starving to death.
Think about it? How many of you only buy everything you need from an NPC vendor? Is that armor you are sporting bought from an NPC vendor? What about that pretty dress?
This change will go into affect around October 10th. It will be on a trial basis and can be altered as we see the need to do it. Any player interested in setting up shop at the Trinsic Sylvan Merchant Mall please page staff. You may have a vendor there, but I also encourage you to try and spend some time there intereacting with players.
I think its a grand plan makes crafters more appreciated and allows them something more to do than just mine valorite and socket.
I like the idea, will give the ones who do have a crafter a chance to have a role in the game. Like Acacia is saying, certain items will remain on NPC vendors, but items like crafted armor, weapons, whittled items, glass blown items, you know the specialty items will be able to be made by the crafters of Sylvan Hearts, and they will be able to be found at the area designated in Trinsic. To the ones who are having a hard time accepting this idea, please give it a chance.
*hoards all the valorite* muahahaha :P
Quote from: Lamalas Telemnar on October 02, 2008, 09:08:33 PM
I think its a grand plan makes crafters more appreciated and allows them something more to do than just mine valorite and socket.
Crafters are already appreciated. I like crafters - I help crafters - I buy from crafters - I RP with craters. They already do LOTS more than mine valorite and socket. There are already lots of "craftable only" items that are cool which ppl collect. To say all that crafters do is mine Val and socket stuff is just insulting (although I figure you didn't mean it to be so... but still). There is no need for bandaids and cloth to the list of "craftable only" items for the sake of RP or otherwise. I would think if I were a crafter, I'd rather spend my time making cool stuff rather bandaids and cloth for myself and others. I'd rather have the ability to go to an NPC vendor and buy the cloth needed to make my cool stuff w/o having to craft something so basic and mundane as... as... a bolt of dumb cloth. And I'm sure I know a few crafters who already agree with me. I don't wanna have to hunt down a player or player vendor every time I need to restock bandaids and just hope that they happen to have some for sale for me... if I can find one that generally sells them that is.
I don't know if there will be price gouging... if there is that will be terrible... but my concern at the moment is mainly the total inconvenience and out-right pain-in-the-tail caused by the removal of bandaids and cloth.
Also... are runes going to be removed? I REALLY hope not.....
Now, I've heard this is a trial period... I hope it is not a "trial to see if it works." because what I take that to mean is this. It's here and live with it... it will sit until it has been long enough to see the effects of it ripple over the shard. And do ya know what that means? It means it sits until the economy changes enough to see what happens... and do you know what that means? It means "it will work." Yes, I said it.. and you know why? Because when we are forced to live with it, we are therefore forced to make it work or just everything will fall apart (which I doubt). Please notice - I didn't say we'd all like it... but if forced, we would of course have to make it work or just fall apart and leave. So, I really hope this isn't that kind of trial period.. and more of a trial to see if everyone likes it rather than just "will it work." I'm trying to have some confidence in the staff on that, and I'll say that I figure they'll be listening to see if ppl like it - hence why I'm voicing my opinion now. If I didn't think staff listened, I'd not bother posting at all, and I'd just pack my bags and leave.
Now, having said all of that *deep breath* ... I'll add that the idea is NOT ALL BAD IN MY OPINION.... only the removal of bandaids, cloth, runes (if runes are being removed), and basic
ingredient food items too maybe (if those are being removed). I'm not as concerned personally about the food ingredients
yet, but I am about the rest.
So, my request is that for convenience sack for fighters and crafters alike... please leave cloth, bandaids, and runes on vendors.
I'll add one more thing...regs and empty bottles are left for alchemist... can't cloth and bandaids be left for tailors? And please for goodness sakes, have mercy and
please do not take this reason of mine and use it to remove regs and bottles. *shutters*
PS. Please... if you reply to my particular post here... don't tell me to give it a chance... because... honestly what choice to have but to "give it a chance" anyway, and I just don't wanna hear that phrase again... (no offence Erif... I'm not trying to target you - I'm posting after you so it isn't like you knew I'd say this lol)
Can you craft runes? Then why would we remove them. I have already said that anything you can't readily get or make in game won't be removed. I guess I didn't specifically say runes.
Very sry Acacia... I didn't know for sure - thank you for clarifying and thank you for reading and replying.
I dont agree with all the changes that are being made to the npc, I am sure that some of the crafters will benifit from the changes . I have crafters myself and i can find tons of things to do with them with out all these changes. the cloth being taken off seems to be the biggest issue i have .the rest of it shouldnt really be a problem . but i have 4 char. and they all use bandaids and I tend to go through alot, and I dont really want to spend my time picking cotton and making thread to make the cloth to make the bandaids. i know it is not hard to make the cloth . but it does take time to do all the things you need to to make the cloth . but i already have to spend alot of my time mining for val. hunting for porcilin to make the mounts, making potions to keep my plants going. and now i will have to find time to do all these little things to make cloth so that i can keep my char's, in bandaids . all I am asking is that you please reconsider taking the cloth off the npc. i can not see where leaving the cloth on would cause a problem for crafters, or any one else in the game. atleast then it will be our chose if we want to make cloth or buy it
OK guys, I have to say this here and some of you will get mad but I'm ok with that. Where were all these voices when Shard Council was going around surveying people about the upcoming change to vendors. How fair is it to be told that these changes are being considered and letting the positive voices ring out while you stay silent until people have done a lot of work to implement something you don't want and only then speak up about it. I'm not saying you don't have the right to be against it, but I am saying it's unfair to criticise after someone has worked hard on this. We work our GMs hard enough without having them do work for nothing. So give it a chance, lets see what happens and I bet if the system is given a chance to work everyone will be saying how good it is in a month or so.
Just my 2 cents.
Also, this is the perfect example of things to use your shard council for. Grab us and talk to us, don't wait for us to come to you.
"OK guys, I have to say this here and some of you will get mad but I'm ok with that. Where were all these voices when Shard Council was going around surveying people about the upcoming change to vendors. "
never heard nothing about it from any shard council member? dont even know when last shard council meeting was held that i have heard about.
Irregardless of that comment
I think its a fantastic idea HOWEVER in light of Cpt making a very valid point about Regs and Bottles (please please dont remove bottles) How about a comprimise that Bandaids will be for sale on Vendors but Cloth you will have to make. that way at least a Emergency supply is available to warriors if none are made.
Me I love to craft But i hate making cloth personally.
Now let me ask this Will Farms or yards allowed to be bigger to account for new demands in farm and grazing land needed? Also can we adjust the cost of Farm animal spawners because i would love to have a chicken and sheep farm for the feathers and wool but 10vs for 3 is ouchy to my budget and only a few of each is kind of pointless. I know of 3 sheep farms that will supply 25 or so Wool if you run em all then start over for another 25 but havent found ab ig feather outlet except killing harpies in newb dungeon lol
Just an idear and opinion (hopefully constructive)
Khayman
""OK guys, I have to say this here and some of you will get mad but I'm ok with that. Where were all these voices when Shard Council was going around surveying people about the upcoming change to vendors. "
never heard nothing about it from any shard council member? don't even know when last shard council meeting was held that i have heard about."
Likewise.
Also, I don't mean to make people work for nothing... if I'd have known this was truly coming sooner then I might have spoken up sooner. I appreciate the hard work our GMs put into things, but I disagree with at least part of this change. They say it is a trial period anyway, so I am supposing that now is not a bad time to voice our opinions. As a matter of fact, I'd say now is the time to indeed be doing so because it aint a trial period for nothing.
The info was out there guys, I asked a few people's opinions on it and I believe my other shard coucil members did the same. WE also had a discussion on forums here: http://www.sylvandreams.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=3863.0
It also included the idea of a black market guy for those things like bottles and bandages that players can make but you might not want to rely on them for.
The support appeared really strong and that is why this went forward. I personally heard no negative comments til now. I again am not dismissing anyone's concerns, just saying I wish we'd heard them sooner.
The whole idea behind this, in my opinion, is to cause more player interaction at a very base level. The kind of mundane everyday work that people do in their lives brought right into the game world and applied to their character's lives.
Wow.. It really sounds uhh.. boring when I put it that way. On the other hand, the mundane is what RP is all about. The boring goes hand in hand with the excitement of adventure.
This plan that the shard council and the staff have come up with.. I can foresee some hardship caused by it. Some conveniences lost but the gain just from those average everyday interactions between players is a seed that may grow into any number of new friendships or rivalries.
Anyone wanna join a new guild thats sole purpose is ransacking villages for their supplies? muhahhahahah Vendors beware The Horde could be coming to you!
Now tell me that wouldnt be fun. The sylvan merchant market no longer safe. Put your goods on your vendors at yoru own discretions. theives could jump out and take all your fine goods at any moment. you best have guards to fight them evil thieves off.
*wonders how much crud he will get for this post and how much will be taken seriously rather then as a joke... hence why im posting this line here to make sure everyone knows its a joke tho it does make a valid point of possibilities for combating your issues with vendors*
Now everyone take a chill pill If everyone is that concerned about a few bandaids Ill go buy up every bolt of cloth now for the next few days and make a qazillion bandaids and you can just come ask me when ya need some and ill gladly give them to you . Tho why you would need anyway since 90% of sylv is either tamers or Druids I have no idea.
Quote from: Marlenus on October 03, 2008, 06:27:26 PM
The whole idea behind this, in my opinion, is to cause more player interaction at a very base level. The kind of mundane everyday work that people do in their lives brought right into the game world and applied to their character's lives.
Wow.. It really sounds uhh.. boring when I put it that way. On the other hand, the mundane is what RP is all about. The boring goes hand in hand with the excitement of adventure.
Marlenus... you're seriousness is scaring me...
Honestly... if I wanted to find more mundane things to do, I'd work more and forget playing Sylvan or any other games... I (and I imagin all who play here) come here for fun and enjoyment... not to find more mundane things to do... this is a fantasy game... it isn't RL and is not meant to be. - let's please not even think about that... *shutters*
LOL @ the first part of Skynar's post. True.... ya want more RL - do that LOL (and I'm kidding too... please do not do that heh)
About the black market guy (and other price gouging vendor ideas)... I see it like this... "ooo can't have players gouge prices! That is just horrid (and it is)... let's get the npcs to do it instead." - and so I say - NO!! Goodness... Have mercy people...
And even if he did not gouge prices, he'd probly be almost uslessly out of stock constantly since players carry 1000's of bandaids each to heal pets, themselves, and other players.
And Alan, I do remember that post now that you mention it (although I'm still not sure I was ever "polled" by council or anyone on this)... Sry, I didn't reply to that other topic... although at that point it was not a solidly stated detail that bandages and cloth would be removed. At that point the whole thing was still an idea being tossed around... an idea that I kinda support with the exception of bandages and cloth. So... without that solid detail that makes so much difference to me, would it have really helped if I had posted at that point considering I didn't know (and probly would not have ever even thought) that those things would be part of the dreaded removal list?
My suggestion, if it is not clear already, is go ahead and remove most craftable things if you really think it is all that great an idea... but for goodness sake... leave bandages and cloth at the very least. I'll also add plain ole regular arrows (if they are due to be removed) to the list of "to stays" seeing as how fletchers can already make really cool arrows... might as well leave the plain arrows for the npcs to bother with instead of having fletchers worry about em and making us hunt fletchers and their vendors (and hope they are stocked) to aquire them.
Also, I counted from that previous posting (the one you reminded me of, Alan) a total of about 6 positive replies (again, this being before the formal details came btw). Now, I alone know at least 6 people who either do not like this at all or who are willing to compromise hoping to at least get bandaids and cloth back. Again, that is just me alone who knows that many (and this is after the final details have been released), so perhaps this is a bit of an indication that there are likely plenty more? Can we please compromise and get back bandaids and cloth at the very least? Please, let this be a suggestion from me and others to be seriously considered as part of the "trial period" and not just as a bunch of "late coming" nay sayers... as I am sry I didn't come sooner... but as I said, I didn't know the details sooner. (If they were stated, then I guess I missed it and still am sry I didn't say anything sooner.)
Good posts guys, I don't want to beat this thing to death, but you have to look at us Shard Council members as your local congressmen. Lobby us for the things you want and tell us when you see something you don't like. The against voices were silent and went without representation. Not because we didn't want to hear you, but because you didn't make yourselves head. Even if a third of the people out there didn't want this we likely would've done more reasearch or possibly had a town hall meeting on it. So please use your shard council. If one isn't on, ask if one can come on. I am on an alt most of the time, but if someone needs a shard council member, I will drop everything and come see you so I can represent you. I am sure the rest of my council members feel the same.
ok, I love this idea. Prices are gonna go down not up. the items in demand are gonna be the ones selling. I just might go pick cotton all day today. If cloth and bandaids are in demand and they are big movers then they will be made and sold by more than one vendor and a price war will ensue. Same for bottles, same for anything. Give it a chance and I think it'll be a good thing. PLus I think it's wasy cooler to go see the armor repair guy rather than just grab a deed. He might even have a new piece that I don't know about he'll offer me at a good price and then we can haggle and such. Mundane? A bit maybe, but how much excitement is there really to shopping for a repair deed going to the shop and clicking it? PLus if you need a lot of something, it'll be much easier to place an order. Need 1000 bottles, you'll get them cheaper than before and you'll probabl employ 2 people. The bottle maker and the sand gatherer. So give it a try and don't sweatt he small stuff. It'll work itself out. If there is a problem, staff and the players here will fix it. :)
Alan... I don't think bottles are being removed... and are you saying the npcs won't even be able to repair items anymore even if you have a repair deed?? :o
Anyway, I'm still not really convinced it is good to take away cloth and bandaids... and not wanting to repeat myself on reasons... so I'll leave it at that. But, I thank you for your dedication, and I plan to keep that in mind. *nods* :)
Sorry if I confused anyone as far as I know repair deeds will still work, the NPCs are not being removed, just the items on their inventory that are craftable.
i got no problems with what is going on at the mo with vendors, i do however, [and did object when subjct was first brought up] to the big vendor mall in trinsic. Many of us have tried to develop our own malls, i personaly have just redecorated little fel mall and would like everyone to visit and shop there, now everyone is going to go to trinsic for shopping>>> what will become of our player malls? it's like big corporate mall shuuting down the corner store...
*grabs protest banner* but i agree with every other aspect of what is being done with the vendors and think its great... 8)
I am all for player malls, and that has been a part of Sylvan from the beginning. Originally, there was a GIGANTIC vendor building built in Maginica with the thought of all vendors being housed there. I was against that and it was changed to where player housed vendors was the way of things, because we wanted to encourage people to get out and visit and find things that way. I don't know how well that ever really worked.
The Trinsic mall was a first step into easing the way for this vendor change. A place where the basics might be found in one sport, meat, fruit, arrows, cloth, things like that. A chance, too, for players to hopefully be there from time to time, on their crafters for a little role play interaction. It was never intended to take the place of the player run malls and I do hope these vendor changes will even be a boost for the home stationed and guild run vendor areas. Trinsic isn't intended to take over everything.
Take a deep cleansing breath.... It will all be okay, it will all be okay, it will all be okay.
;) lol, *Hugs Acacia* it'll be alrite hun, hehe. I got a lil idea tho, why not throw into the trinsic mall area a few looms, wheels n anvils...then the crafters can make stuff to order right there...it'll be like car boot sales and farmers markets... I dont disagree with anythging...long as our vendors are getting paid hahahaha
That stuff is already there at the trinsic mall.
::) *hangs head in shame*
I can't believe the hubbub over fear of bandages being removed. I won't go into how easy it is to make cloth and bandages, you will only say, "but I don't want to do that.. therefore, I don't like it." In about 30 minutes time, you could make enough bandages to last you a month, but I won't tell you that. I will tell you that the player vendors will have tons of cloth on them for you, and tons of bandages you can buy, and in larger quantities than you can get on an NPC vendor.
Vendors will be in game, vendors will give out bods, vendors will buy your junk, vendors will sell you a darn pair of scissors if you need them. I'm even gonna leave the diddly dang bandages on healers, just for you, Link. You'll be able to get way more making your own, or buying from the player vendors. I don't think vendors have a thing to do with using repair deeds, those are made by players to use, but they'll still work. The regs will be there, the bottles will be there, the blank scrolls (though players can craft those) will be there. The current player vendors will still be there, and we'll have a few newer ones in Trinsic, if you want to use them Remember, it will all be okay. If it doesn't work out, our little world will be a heck of a lot easier to fix up than the US economy.
Topic is finished.