Where Do We Go From Here?

[Aesa]

How about we switch to RunUO 2? We will have more content.
Ok here is the big one... NO NO NO NO NO PLEEEEEASE. Our custom stuff is part of the shard history... it is part of what makes it different and special. I am NOT willing to give it up.  If people wanted "better graphics" they'd play WoW or some free 3D MMORPG or something... UO is not all about graphics these days... honestly there is no way it can compete visually with modern games... compaired to modern games... UO and Sylvan stink. I'm not trying to be mean, but that is just how I see it. I don't come here because the graphics are better and I don't need upgraded graphics to stay here... and losing a large part of the history of the shard sure isn't inspiring to me... it is downright depressing. If I wanted better graphics, I could play WoW with my other friends. Again, I'm NOT willing to give up what we have just to "upgrade the graphics"... pffft.

I think what makes us special isn't our custom stuff, but our players and staff.  That's where the shard history is in my opinion.  And we're not discussing a switch over for new graphics only.  We need more content and a 2.0 server.  We are extremely limited on 1.0.  It is NOT supported by the RUNUO team at all and if we switch over to 2.0 we open the door to a ton more custom scripts, custom deco, etc...  We can make Sylvan better doing this.  This will, in a lot of our eyes, attract new players, bring old players back and keep current players.  (I logged on twice recently and I was the only person logged in for over an  hour each time!!)  We can get rid of the socket system, start out fresh and not have to create monsters that no UO player should ever be able to kill single handedly because sockets GREATLY overpower the players.  (and yes, my players panties are even socketed.. she's gotta run with the big boys. lol)  My player is the queen of pixel crack, has a ton of customs, rares and awesome pets, BUT I welcome the change.  I will probably get a copy of the current Sylvan to have on my computer so I can sit in my house and pet my shinies.   

I hope if we decide to make this change over that our current players decide to make the move with us.  It will be a journey we can take together and I'm sure everyone's loyalty to the shard will be rewarded as well.

[Marlenus]

Let's not all start thinking that this is a 100% sure thing just yet. From what I hear, we're going to do a whole lot of testing and tweaking and all kinds of other stuff before we make any kind of final decision.

The good news is... Everyone seems to be willing to stick with Sylvan whether this happens or not. Thank you all!

[Cpt_Starfox]

One more point that I thought of that I wanted to make...
Sylvan probably has more history and more character in one single house than most other shards probably do in their entire world. As a matter of fact, I think we probably have more history and character in one house than all of WoW even does in all it's scripted overblown graphic system. No, I am not willing to change that for any "upgrade". "custom scripts, custom deco, etc" = graphics upgrade pretty much and maybe a few new things we can do... but I'd not think it'd give us that many new abilities and honestly I hardly care. I don't care how many new things it gives, it won't replace the old in my book. Also, just since i heard this last night, I think I've already found two players who agree. And, if you don't like the socket system and think it makes people overpowered... just don't use it! There is always that option.

I DO NOT want to get rid of sockets and I do not think it makes people overpowered. There is still a balance. There are harder monsters for socketed players - even those players that are fully socketed can still find a challenge, and that shows balance in my book.  Just because someone can solo a hard monster doesn't mean there isn't balance.

And the history of the shard is in it's players and staff BUT IT IS ALSO in the custom things our shard has.

I originally came to Sylvan because it was the way it is... and I stay because it has stayed the way it is for the most part. I'm not looking for it to change... and I'm hoping it doesn't... there are plenty of other shards I can play.... but I want to play Sylvan because it is the way it is.

"Let's not all start thinking that this is a 100% sure thing just yet. From what I hear, we're going to do a whole lot of testing and tweaking and all kinds of other stuff before we make any kind of final decision."

hmm - "going to do" - It sounds like it is coming... uggg - and it sounds less and less like I should use the term "we" anymore.

Another thing... if it ever changes (IF - and I serious hope not)... that just means in the mean time while the testing is going on and whatever... that at least I if no-one else would feel like I shouldn't bother even playing seeing as how everything I do is just going to be destroyed and taken for granted anyway.

Again... let me restate in so many words... Just because we go through a low time right now doesn't mean we *must* "upgrade or die" (on the contrary, I'd see the upgrade as more of a death, and I don't think I'm alone on that) - consider all the factors for goodness sake. People have real lives and during this time of year with test, and test study time, and papers due, and economy crunch to help your work life, and plenty of family life with holidays and w/e, and allergies and weather changes to help people's health... honestly... there are a lot bigger and more important factors to consider than a pitiful upgrade. Graphics ain't the only blasted thing that affects our numbers.... uggg... I seriously doubt graphics are going to attract all that many if any new players considering I don't care how much junk you add, it ain't gonna compete with the new games in terms of graphics anyway. Those people seeking graphics will likely always find another better place... those are the people who see the greener grass on the other side of every fence... if you do serious think this will grab new people, take a moment and think - do you really wanna change your player demographic that much?  Quality over Quantity people!!!!

Also. another thought... on this day of Thanksgiving, I'm thankful the shard we currently have, and honestly... if I wanted a change, I think I'd leave and find one because there are probably other shards who already have this "upgrade". The fact that I and other players are still here despite the lack of this "upgrade" says to me that we don't need an "upgrade" to stay.

Also, dumping the customs and everything we accomplished throughout the years of this shard is NOT appreciating our roots and our history in my opinion. It seems more like taking it all for granted. Maybe you feel differently - you have that right... but that is just how I feel.

[samiam]

i am  having a problm fith  geat way

[Stroem Safai]

Well suppose i best say somthing too jk , I love this shard ive been here oh for 900 some odd days yee know couple of years almost since the begining and ive never found a shard or any other game accually that i like more, I love the peaple here and the staff there really what keep me comeing back, I know i dissapear from time to time one time was almost a year before i was able to come back but yet i return allways dreading to think that i might come back and it will all be gone this place is my escape from reality and the troubles in my life. Im all for whatever needs to be done to make this home even greater and grow. Even tho i love the little custom graphics and all my little ancient artifacts *grins and goes plays with his artys*. Well that was my 10cents

[Stroem Safai]

Oh yess an one more thing i forgot to add i also think that there is so many of us that love it here and love how the shard is and runs yuh it sucks that at times there may not be much of anyone on, But the way the shard is and everything about it is what makes it so great and why there is those of us who have been here for so long and have never left........

[Skynar]

Sounds like everyone is jumping to conclusions here and all this thread was, is a sounding board for Acacia and  ideas and how people feel.

Nothing has been decided from what i read.
If the shard were to go to 2.0  does not mean all the custom graphics are gone. that subject hasnt even been breached yet as if its possible to bring em over and if someone can script it.( i can assure you  that it could be figured out.)   we have enough people here with multiple talents to probably figure it out. I for one have a programming degree and am the goto person for the company i work for in the IT dept. When it breaks and no one can figure it out.. they call me.  And I am SURE that i am not the only  IT or programmer here.

It seems like most would like the new content, I would because of the new deco ideas it opens up for us.

Just because its changing version doesnt mean old sylvan is gone.  And even tho I have only been here just over a year...   Its the people  not the material virtual items that make the history of this shard.
They are virtual items and if you dont think that sylvan staff in some way wont try to bring some of that over or show their appreciation in some ways... well your nuts, sorry im just not a pretty speaker.

Change is good sometimes and the benefits outweigh the cons in this case. 

If a ship looks like it could be sinking  are you going to keep using the same ship or get a new one that works better, goes faster, makes more profit  etc.
If your selling a product that goes out of fad  are you going to keep on selling it  or make something better to entice your customers to spend more with you.

Change happens for a reason and its a good thing... otherwise we would still all be hiding in caves and cooking with Dinasour poop.

Khayman

[Cpt_Starfox]

"If a ship looks like it could be sinking  are you going to keep using the same ship or get a new one that works better, goes faster, makes more profit  etc.
If your selling a product that goes out of fad  are you going to keep on selling it  or make something better to entice your customers to spend more with you."

UO in general pretty much fell out of fad and sank ages ago... if I wanted something "in fad" I'd go to WoW with my friends who have been virtually begging me to do so for ages. I could almost care less about "in fad" or a slight "update" to graphics that should have been scraped ages ago like UO graphics (should have been by modern standards that is).

"If the shard were to go to 2.0  does not mean all the custom graphics are gone."
"if you dont think that sylvan staff in some way wont try to bring some of that over or show their appreciation in some ways... well your nuts"

1. The impression I got was it would be gone, but if everything can all be saved.. then maybe it wouldn't be so bad...

2. I also got the impression that if there was a change of that magnitude, that they wanted to get rid of the way things are. Maybe not all the custom graphics, but other things tho such as the socket system and the current balance in game in general (mobs/economy/etc)... And I am not for that at all even in the least.

3. Sylvan ain't sinking. That is just about an insult to those of us who (as Stroem put it) have been here for so long and have stayed here. If Sylvan is in such bad shape... why are we even here in the first place??? I'd not come here much less stay here as long as I have if I thought the place has been falling apart forever.

"Change happens for a reason and its a good thing"
This isn't only about change... partly, yes, but not totally.

"Its the people  not the material virtual items that make the history of this shard"
People live the history - the "artifacts" show and record it and retell it long after the people have gone.  I'm not planning on giving that up nor do I think we need to "rebalance" everthing that really doesn't need it.

Let me give a "short" spill on balance... just because a tough player can solo just about anything they want given about 45 mins to do it... doesn't mean there is a lack of balance!!!!!

Ok, so what signs would show a lack of balance?

1. Is the shard too easy? Too newbie friendly?
Answer = NO - if you want to die and you think you are all that can't find a challenge anymore.... Well, I can certainly point you to some places that might change your mind. Sure you might have beaten them before given the 2yrs+ you've probly been here... but still can you solo it?  How well can you solo it? What's the smallest group you can do it with? Do you have the skills it would take to run a very successful group hunt?  -  There are challenges like that for the high-end gamer. Note: Just because you think that some boss should not be soloable and then someone does it, doesn't mean we lack balance... just means ya make a harder boss!  Muwahaha!!  I think I could enjoy doing that myself hehe hmmm *thinks*

2. Well is the shard too hard due to making everything for the end-gamers?
Answer = NO - There are dungeons of almost every level!  Sylvan has a near perfect stair-step balanced mob system to lead you from easy to nightmarishly hard. I've walked my way up through it and I know that it works 

3. Can only one type of player succeed in fights? OR can only one type of player make money?
Answer = NO, in most cases you can use any type of character to do anything you want... You just have to have the skills and know-how to pull it off  As far as Money, on Sylvan... for goodness sake... you can make money just being creative and selling Christmas ornaments, so... I don't see how there is an issue there. There are more ways to make money in Sylvan than I care to count... if one way doesn't make enough money for you, just combine it with another way. Granted Sylvan can hardly accommodate every single "business" type and make sure it ends being filthy rich.... like if you try to sell plain boots to make money... don't expect to be filthy rich in one day lol - but the Sylvan economy is fairly accommodating to variety and creative thinking 

Bottom line - Sylvan rocks the way it is and I don't care to lose that... and I don't see me changing my mind on any of this any time soon either just to let ya know 

[Teclis]

I just want to take a moment to thank Starfox for his comments. The "other side" was very quiet during the discussion of changing how the vendors work, then got very vocal afterwards. If others are strongly opposed to a major change, I would like to hear from them as well, and if others are strongly in favor of a major change they should speak out also. I am personally sorta on the fence. I want to see the shard do better and there is a good chance making this change could help us. RunUO no longer provides support to 1.0 so the fact of the matter is everyday we fall further and further behind other shards who are able to offer more. The graphics would remain mostly the same, however we'd get new dungeons, new monsters, and be able to make new custom items. I don't know if an arrangement could be made for a player to be able to transfer a few items from the old shard to the new, I am definitely in favor of that, as many of the vets have worked extremely hard to get their things and I know I have at least one item that I worked many, many months to obtain. Again, remember to keep it all friendly here and again thanks Starfox for the great comments.

[Aesa]

I'd just like to make a statement here.

I think no matter which way we go.. either switch over to 2.0 or stay with shard the way it currently is we should support Acacia in whatever decision she makes.  She was the one that stepped up and took over when the original owner of Sylvan pulled the plug unexpectedly.  She spends more time logged in than any of  you can EVER imagine.  This shard has been her "baby" for years.  We have her to thank that there has even been a Sylvan for the past 2+ years.  Whatever decision she makes I can assure you it won't be one that's taken lightly or made without MUCH thought and consideration of the pros and cons and how it will affect the shard long term and our players.

[Mirage]

I read this and couldn't help but give my opinion. As an admin for a L2 server I know how Acacia feels. It's  very frustrating thing. But Acacia my dear..my sweet Sylvan Admin..it's not the server. With economy and real life stuff, people just might not be having the time. Or in this case at the moment it's the holidays. During the holidays games tend to slow because people are sharing their time with family and friends.

I know my want to be in sylvan has been hindered by the crash of my computer. Which I've already spent 200$ on fixing just so I could return. *giggles* Now I just need to download...get in..yadda yadda.

If the webpage is a problem I don't mind helping with that. I mean I offered to do it like a year ago.

Sylvan is the best UO server I've ever played and even love over some other games. And I've played a lot of servers and a lot of games. If I can do anything to help at all just tell me. Now that things are settled and I got my computer working again I got lots of time to shed on sylvan.

[Skynar]

"If a ship looks like it could be sinking  are you going to keep using the same ship or get a new one that works better, goes faster, makes more profit  etc.
If your selling a product that goes out of fad  are you going to keep on selling it  or make something better to entice your customers to spend more with you."

Ok Link please dont take that out of context  I was not and am not referring to Sylvan as a sinking ship or fad.

My point was that when things are not  going "good" then Change may improve things.

I stand for the change but either way its still a good shard and Acacia and all the gms(tho some of them irritate me from time to time LOL) have done a good job.  This is the best priv shard I have ever been on and I have gm'd on one of the first private shards there ever was.

Acacia has NOT taken the shard down the wrong path before and I am sure she wont this time neither

[Lamalas Telemnar]

I do want to point out a few things if we do and i say IF we do change over. The majority of the work will all be on t he scripter. As to our customs a lot of them use the item id of the mondaines legacy items so it would all rely on a scripter picking and chooseing what new items we wanted ( maybe getting rid of a few old ) The Change will require  time and patiance its not a quick fast easy thing. Goiing to a new game core would require adding new scripts trying to add in old scripts etc etc . Only thing else i can say is if you love it here Roll with it either way Its not the game that makes the game but the people that play it. And while i am here i want to apologize to everyone players and staff alike my real life is really fubared. But i will try to still make as much time to be here as i can And SUPPORT Acacia 100% in what ever direction she decides to take our lil home away from home.

[Mina]

i agree with everyone,  whatever direction shard is going to go in..whatever Acacia puts forth,  we are all going to be behind her.  It's great to get so many opinions..  i know it has really sucked recently on the shard, not many around at all.  Me..  i get on when i can, sometimes it's just a couple of us on(yet still events get offered by gm's). Times are hard as we all know, my work kills my game time some days and others have their own rl issues.  We should just all do whatever we can to promote the shard, to get more than just our friends on it and help lift the populatiuon up a lil.   

[Quezecoatl]

I read this and couldn't help but give my opinion. As an admin for a L2 server I know how Acacia feels. It's  very frustrating thing. But Acacia my dear..my sweet Sylvan Admin..it's not the server. With economy and real life stuff, people just might not be having the time. Or in this case at the moment it's the holidays. During the holidays games tend to slow because people are sharing their time with family and friends.

Mirage is correct the way the economy has been people having to worry about real life , holidays, and so on time for gaming goes down, i myself have been off due to well health and money issues leave it at that and i want to play its just i dont have the time, also for the younger ones mid terms and such are right around the corner and creep closer and closer with everyday, its true some people prefer new and improved games so they go and get a ps3 or a nintendo wii, or a xbox 360 but some still stick with the *oldies* i love sylvan the way it is i want to play it more but because of current things going on my online time has decreased now hopefully health issue will find a answer after dec. 4th but how many people spend the holidays with family away from your own computer, economy has forced people to push gaming aside of overtime at ther jobs if they even still have jobs and arnt looking for new ones. why change a great thing sylvan is what it is for not just the people not just the admins not just the omg look a shinny *drool* but all of them combined and formed into one you subtract 1 of them from the equation and something goes out of wack ...kinda like rocket science something gets added wrong and it ends up in a downfall I love sylvan ive got my moments wher i need a break from it this time its a unwanted break but one i have to take *curses hospitals doctors and anything medical related as well as economy* but i look forward to signing on going through my shinnies talking to friends trading shinnies and so on the way its always been.